[JnC]

I know I should know this but...

My mini is not with me now so I can't test this and I'd like to be sure about this before proceeding with updates.

I need to have functioning USB ports for my wireless mouse and for frequent access to my USB flash drives for saving documents. (Not to mention the possible crisis need to boot from the USB, but that can be accessed through function keys, I know.)

1. If USB Legacy Support is disabled does that mean the ports do not function?
2. BUT, is disabling USB Legacy Support the only way to make sleep work?
3. When doing the software update from 10.6.3 to 10.6.4 does it matter if the USB is disabled or not?

J

[underwhelmed]

1. Disabling USB Legacy does not make the USB ports cease to function.

2. I don't know if it is the only way to make sleep work, but it seems to be.

3. I doubt it matters. You will be re-starting the mini after the update is finished installing, not going to sleep. Just be sure to let the NBI run on start up and don't get impatient and try to re start it again. It takes a while for the NBI to do it's thing before you get to your desktop.

[JnC]

Thank you underwhelmed, .
You are always so helpful when answering my questions! A few further ones below...my mini is still not in my hands, so I can't test this out, but I am just getting my ducks in order to do the next big thing.

Originally Posted by underwhelmed

1. Disabling USB Legacy does not make the USB ports cease to function.

2. I don't know if it is the only way to make sleep work, but it seems to be.

3. I doubt it matters. You will be re-starting the mini after the update is finished installing, not going to sleep. Just be sure to let the NBI run on start up and don't get impatient and try to re start it again. It takes a while for the NBI to do it's thing before you get to your desktop.

1. So, if USB ports will still work when Legacy Support is disabled, then what does USB Legacy Support (hereinafter referred to as USBLS) actually do?

2. With USBLS disabled, what other settings do I need to adjust to make sleep work? (like the sleep setting in syst prefs?) or can you please point me to a thread that will simply list the settings that need to be adjusted for sleep to work? (I've read a lot about sleep, but the discussions seem to go on forever with folks reporting in on whether or not sleep works for them) I understand most Mac stuff; it's the PC BIOS stuff that throws me.

3. Do you know what happens when one tries to boot from a USB flash drive if USBLS is disabled? I know how easy it is to do if USBLS is enabled and I don't know if ths is where the difference comes in.

Thanks as always for your help,
J

[underwhelmed]

Always happy to help, if I can.
I wish I could point you to a comprehensive thread about Sleep and USBLS, but I don't think I have ever seen a clear and concise one here. I can simply pass along what has worked for myself and many other people in the past.

1. USBLS allows you to use USB keyboards and mice in DOS mode before Windows loads. It also allows you to boot from USB hard drives and flash drives.

2. For me, on each of my Dell's, getting Sleep to work was just a matter of disabling USBLS after installing OS X and running NBI. Sleep works 100% for me. I think people confuse Sleep (which works) with Hibernation (which some claim to have working, but they usually are confused). Once I did that, I could simply close the lid on my mini and it goes to Sleep and wakes up once I open it back up. I can also select Sleep from the Apple Menu and it works.

3. With USBLS disabled you would not be able to boot from a USB port. So, if you are booting from a flash drive or an external hard drive, you would want USBLS enabled for that. Again, I leave mine disabled unless I am needing to boot from an external hard drive or flash drive, in which case I enable it to do so, and disable it again once I am finished. If you are just wanting to access an external USB hard drive or Flash drive (like for photo or music storage) you can leave USBLS disabled in the BIOS.

Real Mac's don't have BIOS, I believe they use EFI? Anyway, the BIOS settings on a regular PC tend to not play well with Mac OS X when you make a Hackintosh. By turning as many off as we can that cause a conflict we get a smoother operating machine.

If you try and close your mini and have it Sleep with USBLS enabled, it either won't sleep, or won't wake up. If you have a USB mouse plugged in and USBLS enabled and you try to make the mini sleep, it likewise causes the system to either not wake up, or not sleep properly.

I hope this helps you, I'm not really a techie type person, I just have a good memory for "Tribal Knowledge" and obsolete tidbits I have gleaned in the past year or so reading these boards.

[JnC]

Originally Posted by underwhelmed

...1. USBLS allows you to use USB keyboards and mice in DOS mode before Windows loads. It also allows you to boot from USB hard drives and flash drives..

1. So in OS X, USBLS is not involved in having the ports be functional once you are up and running?

Originally Posted by underwhelmed

2. .. just a matter of disabling USBLS after installing OS X and running NBI. Sleep works 100% for me...

Once you've disabled USBLS, you've just left it disabled for all the updates and whatever else you perform, right? and sleep works? That sounds great.

Originally Posted by underwhelmed

3. With USBLS disabled you would not be able to boot from a USB port... I leave mine disabled unless I am needing to boot from an external hard drive or flash drive, in which case I enable it to do so, and disable it again once I am finished.....

The only time I think I'd need to boot from my emergency flash drive is if I am on the road (aka out of the country and away from my Macs and my backup HDs). What I need to know is - if for some reason OS X fails me on my mini, should I still be able to access BIOS to re-enable USBLS in order to boot from the flash drive? I'll be able to do this, I assume, by using setup options at startup (F2/setup or better still F12/one time boot option if I recall) and switching disable to enable in BIOS - I can't remember how I did this initially, but I'll be sure to test it before we leave.

Originally Posted by underwhelmed

Real Mac's don't have BIOS, I believe they use EFI? Anyway, the BIOS settings on a regular PC tend to not play well with Mac OS X when you make a Hackintosh. By turning as many off as we can that cause a conflict we get a smoother operating machine..

Thanks for this explanation - it's never been clear. I asked a question earlier in my hacking adventures if BIOS were something like System Prefs - I guess at some even more basic level, they are.

When you've made a back-up USB flash of your system, have you used MBR or GUID? I'm pretty sure you've read my steps for How I made a bootable clone flash drive for my mini - and even recommended it to someone, thanks for the vote of confidence - and I wonder what partition format you've use? I made my flash drive initially in MBR since I figured at the most basic level my mini is a PC (yuk) and I suspect that that's why making the drive took so long (for only 7GB of stuff). After I update to 10.6.4, I'll remake the bootable flash with just the system and a few apps and I think I'll wipe clean the flash drive and do it all over, this time in GUID.

Originally Posted by underwhelmed

I hope this helps you, I'm not really a techie type person, I just have a good memory for "Tribal Knowledge" and obsolete tidbits I have gleaned in the past year or so reading these boards.

I'm not a techie type either, but I do like to try to figure out why things work as they do and try to learn as much as possible before changing anything when I have something that works well now...but I do feel I should update to 10.6.4...

Thanks again ,
J

[BrianMc]

Originally Posted by JnC

1. So in OS X, USBLS is not involved in having the ports be functional once you are up and running?

Nor in Windows! With "USB legacy support" disabled in the kernel these ports still work just fine in my dual-boot OSX/Windows XP system. What they no longer do is allow for booting (via the F12 key when the BIOS is loading) - but this can be changed back at any time (press F2 to enter BIOS setup)

[JnC]

Originally Posted by BrianMc

Nor in Windows! With "USB legacy support" disabled in the kernel these ports still work just fine in my dual-boot OSX/Windows XP system. What they no longer do is allow for booting (via the F12 key when the BIOS is loading) - but this can be changed back at any time (press F2 to enter BIOS setup)

Thanks for that info, BrianMc.
I've been accessing booting from my USB flash drive (to check my flash drive in case it's need for emergencies) through F12.
Is it a pain to change the BIOS setting via F2?

I assume F2 is accessible even when there's an OS X issue that requires booting from the flash drive (I see it when I boot in the right corner when the Dell logo comes on). Mind you, I NEVER have had to boot from anything other than the internal drive with any of my real Macs, but I still am unsure of my mini's Macability.

J

[Side.Step.Society]

Your BIOS are always accessible, regardless of which OS is on your hard drive. You won't have any trouble accessing the BIOS set up. BIOS are completely independent of the OS.

[underwhelmed]

JNC,

USBLS is not required to use the USB other than to boot up from an external drive. You can always re-enable it as Hackintoshing the mini does nothing to the BIOS (Basic Input Output System). The BIOS is just a very basic OS that is stored on the system board that kick starts the machine and does some tests before the OS loads.

I leave my USB Legacy disabled unless I need to boot from my install flash drive to fix something I have messed up, or if I would ever need to boot from my back up. Otherwise it stays disabled so sleep works 100% reliably. Not Hibernation, but Sleep.

As far as my back up drive, I formatted mine GUID.

[pokenguyen]

I use SL 10.6.4 with the latest NBI, Mini 10v BIOS A05 and have USB Legacy always Enabled. My mini works well and I have not met any problems with Sleep yet